The Only Capital of Israel

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Nicholas
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The Only Capital of Israel

Post by Nicholas »

It will take a few years to actually have a building for the US Embassy in Jerusalem, but the President of the US has stated as policy what Israel declared in 1950.

https://stream.org/why-it-matters/

Most religious Jews & Christians are pleased.
Last edited by Nicholas on Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Only Capitol of Israel

Post by DNS »

I lived in Jerusalem for 2 years during high school years, learned Hebrew, some Arabic. I could have sworn that when I rode my bicycle almost daily to the Old City where the holy sites are, that I passed by several embassies of various nations, but it turns out only Bolivia and Paraguay have embassies in Jerusalem right now.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... _Jerusalem

Or maybe it was the consulates that I saw passing by. Or perhaps there were more embassies at that time and since then have pulled them out and moved them back to Tel Aviv, though not sure.

The Knesset (parliament) is in Jerusalem, all national government offices are in Jerusalem; as far as Israel is concerned and how it runs, their capitol is Jerusalem, however, the Palestinians believe their capitol is Jerusalem too, thus, the controversy and conflict.
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Re: The Only Capitol of Israel

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Most Christians in Jerusalem itself are not pleased: https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.827207

In fact, I'd wager that, outside American evangelicals, Christians are generally not fans of this irresponsible move.
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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The devil on my shoulder says (I think it got this from a TV show): “They’ll like us when we win!”

The devil on my other shoulder says: “These characters have been trying to kill each other for four and a half thousand years. Do you, honestly, deep down, truly give a shit? Go eat some ice cream, immediately, and stfu.”

The angel on my shoulder says ...

Unfortunately I have run out of shoulders.
And nobody in all of Oz. No Wizard that there is or was.
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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It is a curious flaw that the three theistic religions hold dear - specific plots of dirt.

We Buddhists revere the Bodhi Tree and where Buddha was born etc. But hardly would make their locations critical or central to our faith. Why the big Three do so is beyond me.

The only other example that comes to mind is among the Earth worshiping native tribes of America. Their sense of 'our' land, 'our' sacred sites etc. is powerful too.
Dhamma is against the stream of common thought, deep, subtle, difficult, delicate, unseen by passion’s slaves cloaked in the murk of ignorance. Vipassī Buddha
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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Positing this as a chiefly religious or ethnic problem is a rather facile analysis that ignores the massive interventions of imperial powers in the region.

And Buddhists can be just as passionate about plots of dirt as anyone.
The ladder that leads to the Kingdom is hidden within you, and is found in your soul. Dive into yourself, and in your soul you will discover the rungs by which you are to ascend. - St. Isaac of Syria
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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Iconodule wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 3:42 pm Positing this as a chiefly religious or ethnic problem is a rather facile analysis that ignores the massive interventions of imperial powers in the region.

And Buddhists can be just as passionate about plots of dirt as anyone.
Yes, there were many Imperial regimes that have gone through the Middle East, Palestine area, but many did so because of the religious significance.

There are Buddhist nations that can be passionate about plots of dirt, but that has more to do with nationalism and ethnicity than religion, for example the Myanmar situation. There is no "holy land" in Buddhism. Yes, there is Bodh Gaya and other sites related to Buddha's life and teaching, but an arahant can attain enlightenment any where. Sariputra was enlightened at Vulture Peak, not Bodh Gaya and numerous other arahants were enlightened in other places.
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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Nicholas wrote: Sun Dec 10, 2017 6:26 pm It is a curious flaw that the three theistic religions hold dear - specific plots of dirt.
I could understand their views if this were 1000 CE or 1000 BCE, but now this is the 21st century. We can see what the globe looks like from space, that it is a sphere, that the image we have is a snap shot in time. The continents are moving all the time, land is moving and shifting. India was a large piece of land that "crashed" into the Asian continent millions of years ago creating the Himalayas. There can be no holy land when you realize it is all moving and changing all the time.
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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DNS wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 4:57 pm
Nicholas wrote: Sun Dec 10, 2017 6:26 pm It is a curious flaw that the three theistic religions hold dear - specific plots of dirt.
I could understand their views if this were 1000 CE or 1000 BCE, but now this is the 21st century. We can see what the globe looks like from space, that it is a sphere, that the image we have is a snap shot in time. The continents are moving all the time, land is moving and shifting. India was a large piece of land that "crashed" into the Asian continent millions of years ago creating the Himalayas. There can be no holy land when you realize it is all moving and changing all the time.
There is another reason 'sacred lands' may still have a pull on minds of humans. All cultures, tribal or otherwise have long believed in & worshiped the god of their place or town. These devas are real and live, compared to humans, a very long time. For example, Milarepa was always running into the protective god of a mountain range etc. The Greeks, if I recall had a tradition of each city having its protecting angel and centers of worship & propitiation were set up.
Dhamma is against the stream of common thought, deep, subtle, difficult, delicate, unseen by passion’s slaves cloaked in the murk of ignorance. Vipassī Buddha
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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DNS wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 4:54 pm
Iconodule wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 3:42 pm Positing this as a chiefly religious or ethnic problem is a rather facile analysis that ignores the massive interventions of imperial powers in the region.

And Buddhists can be just as passionate about plots of dirt as anyone.
Yes, there were many Imperial regimes that have gone through the Middle East, Palestine area, but many did so because of the religious significance.
The present situation is in large part the result of cynical machinations by European powers whose motivations were anything but pious.
There are Buddhist nations that can be passionate about plots of dirt, but that has more to do with nationalism and ethnicity than religion, for example the Myanmar situation.
You don't think Zionism has anything to do with nationalism and ethnicity? Sounds like we're dealing with "no true Scotsman" here.
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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So no comparison with one of the Five Pillars of Islam, regarding worshiping dirt? Why the required pilgrimage to a place where there is a most 'sacred' rock?

Why is part of Jerusalem so 'sacred' - because Mohamet flew there on the back of divine donkey.

Political Zionism (religious Zionism actually opposed forming a Jewish state) has only existed for 100 plus years. Political Islam has never not existed since its founding 1400 or so years ago.
Dhamma is against the stream of common thought, deep, subtle, difficult, delicate, unseen by passion’s slaves cloaked in the murk of ignorance. Vipassī Buddha
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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The soil of Tibet was soaked by the internecine warfare there between red hats and yellow hats. Japanese soldiers massacred their way across China and the Pacific with the hearty encouragement of Buddhist clergy. The Rohingya are murdered now with the encouragement of Buddhist monks. I'm not going to take your Buddhist chauvinism seriously, sorry.
The ladder that leads to the Kingdom is hidden within you, and is found in your soul. Dive into yourself, and in your soul you will discover the rungs by which you are to ascend. - St. Isaac of Syria
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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Iconodule wrote: Mon Dec 11, 2017 7:15 pm I'm not going to take your Buddhist chauvinism seriously, sorry.
Scale in time & events matters - so your false equivalence is pitiable.
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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Update: UN votes 128-9 condemning the Trump move of the embassy to Jerusalem, with 35 abstentions.

Israel and the U.S. will just ignore this resolution, like all the past ones.

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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

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Trump has, however, threatened to cut off funding for countries that voted yes. Can anyone imagine him cutting off funding to the Saudis? Yeah, me neither.
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Re: The Only Capital of Israel

Post by Nicholas »

There were also 25? nations (193 total) who did not vote, so the real tally is more like 128 to 70 roughly.

The US policy toward individual nations will not vary much based on one symbolic toothless UN vote. What may and should happen is reduction of the US monetary contribution to the UN.
Dhamma is against the stream of common thought, deep, subtle, difficult, delicate, unseen by passion’s slaves cloaked in the murk of ignorance. Vipassī Buddha
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